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Discussion Forum

4 Aug 2012, 9.55PM
Well, as we have read about the recent adjustment to the employment pass requirement to more stringently control the quality of our foreign talents. However there seems to be loop holes which our MOM has not think of or able to anticipate.

I was shared with a story that if one foreigner is not eligible anymore for his EP because his salary was not high enough to meet. 

There is 2 options available for the company to secure this resource. 

1. Increase his salary to the cap so that the applications for renewal to EP meets the requirement.

2. Drop the employee category to S Pass to apply again.

It seems like when our MOM was trying to curb talents influx but the companies here was smarter to counter impact the changes impose by the authority. probably the HR was foreign as well.....

one thing which i am pretty sure is that. when you have open the gate earlier to all the so call foreign talents then you have a hard time kicking them out. 

However, i still pretty surprise that foreign diploma holders was also consider as Talents. If that was talented enough to draw salary above S$4500 to eligible for EP or jerking with the salary cap to gain an S Pass because that employee is still cheaper than Singaporean. Are we really short of Accountants? Managers, Engineers, ? those in the higher salaried industry OR we are just short of Waiters? Crew men, service staffs, concierge? cleaners?

Well then, thats the real end for singaporeans. I would not know what will be the futures of my children if they could survive and have a job to work and live in Singapore.

Happy Birthday Singapore. !


2481 views  |  11 comments & replies  | 
Guest
6 Aug 2012, 5.12PM
I like to share a recent incident that happened in an MNC.
A sales manager, an Indian national, came to work in Singapore a few years ago.
During this period, he hired about a dozen of people, engineers, sales engr, managers, etc, all
from his own country, India. Recently he got promoted to the business unit manager
and in 2 weeks, he retrenched a dozen staff, engrs, sales engr, managers, etc, most of them
Singaporeans. My questions to the government

1. How is having foreign talent creating more jobs for Singaporeans?
Can the government please provide some statistics on this matter.

2. Will the government do something to prevent such situation from happening again ?

3. You, the government, what do you have to say to the dozen of victims of racial discrimination?
Will the government please tackle these racial discrimination issues before bringing in more
foreign talents and creating more tensions?

4. Can our schools and polytechnics  not churn out graduates to meet the market needs ?
We often hear employers have to look for foreign workers and locals find it hard to get
a job.

The issue of foreign talents and social cohesion/tension is get more acute.
Please tell us like the song "What do you see? "
Guest
7 Aug 2012, 10.32AM
In some ways I agree with you. I have a Filipino friend who tried to look for a job in Singapore because the boyfriend is in Singapore. She wasn’t very successful in her initial job hunt. In the end, she was hired…. by her boyfriend’s company. While I am happy for her (because she is a friend), I also can’t help but feel that foreign nationals favour their own kind.. especially when my friend’s previous profession is vastly different from the job that she got in her boyfriend’s company.
 
Yet I also hear of Singaporean friends and relatives who work in SMEs complaining that they just can’t find Singaporeans to apply for jobs when they advertise. They get plenty of applications from foreigners, but none from Singaporeans. And such job openings range from waitressing to architect positions. So what do companies in such situations do?
 
Tackling immigration issues is but one factor. The question employers face is also where are the Singaporean workers? I had asked some of them.. is it because what they were offering too low a salary.. and they tell me, if there are no Singaporean applicant applying, there are none they can call up for interviews.. how to even offer anything.
Guest
11 Aug 2012, 6.31PM
SME are paying their workers $2000 to $2300 dollars. And it's quite low nowdays. How many of the 30++ can work at that wages and start a family ?

$330,000 for HDB. Car $150,000. BUS/MRT $500 per month.
FOOD. $400 to $500 liao one person. Clothing $400 to $600 liao. Enough for baby milk ? $49.70 per tin 900 grams ?

Be worry. And be super worry.
Guest
27 Aug 2012, 5.36PM
I super agree...the damage already done long time ago that leads to a lot of issues down the road. Now even closing the gates and still have loop holes...is already too late...better late than never....but a lot of damage done...and is going to take many years to put it right...and many have lost their "younger years"..and cannot reverse back and the damage is permanent. And there will be a lot of trouble down the road.
REACH Administrator
30 Aug 2012, 9.39AM
Dear Guest,

Thank you for your posting.

We refer to the posting to the thread titled "Differences between Employment Pass and S Pass" on the REACH website dated 6 Aug 2012, 5.12PM. We have kept the relevant agencies informed on your feedback and they would like to contact you for more details on your feedback. Hence, we would appreciate it if you could provide us with your contact details and email address via email to reach@reach.gov.sg for follow-up.

Kindly attention the email to Ling by indicating in the subject "(To Ling) Discussion Thread: Differences between Employment Pass and S Pass".

Thank you and looking forward to hearing from you.

Regards
Ling (REACH Administrator)
Guest
5 Aug 2012, 6.38PM
The more types of passes we have . . .the better. This is based on the assumption that MoM can fully utilised these differences to REACT faster when the economy is bad.

Frankly, Trainee Pass+ Dependent Pass+ LTVP plus+ EP+ WP+ SP . . .ALL allows foreigners to work in Singapore. That is the reason why MoM has aggravated the situation when the economy is bad.

Yes, indeed they will totally loose FACE in the world if they UNDO Gan Kim Yong's mistake ie 50k wrong issuance of EP. That is why, 300k of citizens are still suffering from the bad decision and poor managment of the government, even till now.

It is a great joke for Goh Chok Tong to define a large group of foreigners as TALENTS.

1. Work permit holders (uneduated or low-educated workforce)
Construction workers, retail assistant, waitors . . .etc

2. S-Pass ( low-educated but needed by our economy).
After pushing our education and WDA, do we still need this group?

3. EP ( semi-skilled and half Fake- talents)
I mean an Indonesian degree is only equivalent to our O'Levels. Why issue even a EP to him? Worse, some of the EP holders do not have the relevant degree to even do the job, others do not even have sufficient relevant experience before they are posted from Austrslia to Singapore.







(Guru)
Dreamknight
13 Aug 2012, 11.23AM
There may not be an error  ( total ) in the issuance of 50K of EP.

50K per year for 10 years is still a meagre 500K increase in population. This is something Singapore should still be able to handle.

I still think that the larger increase is still at the low end spectrum.

Some of these new EPs may be entreperneurs and a small startup could easily employ another 5 - 10 workers. If a 50% ratio is used, you get a 2.5x to 5x factor for every EP. That will translate to around 125K 250K increase per year.

So it seems to substantiate the theory the EPs are generating more employment opportunities.

Productivity is the concern. Under Gan KY, a productivity improvement was moving underneath along with the increase is population. They knew then that GDP growth based on population gained is not sustainable and is trying hard to overcome the labour increase only gain. Unfortunately, the productivity movement was overshadowed and cheap labour is still the only thing on the minds of the bosses. Moreover, the ability to push foreign workers to limit like over time and underpay makes companies prefer foreign workers to the more "choosy" locals who wanted more pay, more family time and less willing to work outside normal duties. The pressure from the short term thinking bosses thus tilt the balance and practically forces MOM to comply or otherwise threaten with a lower growth.

Many of these short term thinking bosses are still around, all out to reap the maximum profits. Unless the government have enough guts to go against these rich and powerful, the situation is unlikely to ever change.
Guest
5 Aug 2012, 9.03PM
The government wants to look good only on the outside, even if the inside is cracking, rotting or stinking!

Remember what Lim Wee Kiak said about Dignity? To PAP, having face pasted with gold and daimonds is more important.

But serioulsy, IF REALLY Talent, they should be drawing at last $8k per mth and meet 3 other criteria. I think that MoM has very LOW standards.



Guest
6 Aug 2012, 9.10AM
Agree . . .they only WANT QUANTITY at the expense of quality!!

Want so many foreigners. . . . but 80% of low quality.

Want so many foreign kids. . . . but our school system cannot support 45 students per class.

Want so many foreign students on scharships . . . but only 50% of them score above average.

Want so many train lines . ..  but train rides of low service quality.

Want so many bicyclist . . . but pedestrains have to give way to selfish rider.

Guest
6 Aug 2012, 12.19PM
    You forgot. . . even the PAP is over-filled out of the brim, with all sorts of Ministers, but for the past 6 years, not proven desirable nor concrete results.
Guest
6 Aug 2012, 3.26PM
How come Town Council still not looking at improvements?

So many foreigners under them here in Singapore, some are from China. Why issue their spouses  Dependent Pass? So so that they can apply for SPR status? For what?

1. Did the PRC employee prove that they can perform very well?
2  Was 24 mths time frame set to ensure that they hold the correct values of a developed society?

Frankly, Town Councils in Singapore need to learn alot from private sectors. It's just round the corner and not 2000 km away.

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